Active alternating air cushions???

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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 09:56

The whole point is that they must alternate every 5 to 10 minutes. The powered cushions dont inflate and stay still. They have two different sets of cells or bars. So first one set is inflated. Then the other. So that you are sat on different points alternately all day long every few minutes. This means that the whole of your backside gets chance for blood to circulate 50% of the time minimum. So no sores.

And ideally, you dont need or in fact want that over the whole area of the cusion. Just the rear bit where your 3 high pressure areas are.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby snaker » 25 Jul 2018, 10:37

I bought this air cushion. It has a 220V pump and it alternates bars. But it was a waste, it did not work as desired. First the pump is too weak. Second, the time between 2 alternating stages is too long (maybe 30 minutes), it should be around 5 minutes.
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a1 ... 0925098148

I also bought this cheap air cushion. My 5.5 years old terrible sore was completely healed after 2 months sitting on it. In fact, the sore appeared good right after the first day. And it was nearly cured after 4 weeks. More interestingly, I could still sit and work as usual during those 2 months, no need obeying any treatment.
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a1 ... 5635532307
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 11:04

I bought this air cushion. It has a 220V pump and it alternates bars. But it was a waste, it did not work as desired. First the pump is too weak. Second, the time between 2 alternating stages is too long (maybe 30 minutes), it should be around 5 minutes.
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a1 ... 0925098148


All the ones I see are switchable 5 mins or 10 mins. And adjustable pressure, 3 settings or infinitely variable. So beware chinese, you never know what quality you get. Also you dont want it over the whole cushion. As the parts with your weight, just push the air to the bit at the front. So you need more pressure. Which was your problem with the one you had.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby sacharlie » 25 Jul 2018, 13:59

flagman1776 wrote:The gel honey comb I'm sat on at the moment is only 1.5" (38.1mm)..


What brand is that?
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 14:05

Cancelled the order since they are making bullshit escuses about missing todays delivery. And wasted another 2 days of my life. So they are scammers. And a bunch of review sites agrees. So cancelled. Instead I ordered from

https://www.spearheadhealthcare.com/Cat ... 502-ALT215

They included the USB hand controller for free, and they changed the pump/battery for a more expensive quieter slightly higher pressure one for high risk or ongoing sore issues. For free. And price matched the lower price. Total cost 410.

And garanteed delivery for 1pm tomorrow. So another 24 hours wasted on my bed.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby flagman1776 » 25 Jul 2018, 14:21

sacharlie wrote:
flagman1776 wrote:The gel honey comb I'm sat on at the moment is only 1.5" (38.1mm)..


What brand is that?


Wondergel.
This exact unit. https://www.amazon.com/WonderGel-Suppor ... nk20248-20

I had actually ordered the square 2" Wondergel but this is what came.

I changed the chair under it yesterday & it's an improvement but I spend almost all of my time sitting... I need to do more or I'm going to be in trouble.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby sacharlie » 25 Jul 2018, 15:57

Got a couple Miracle Cushion gel out of Utah. They are 1.75" thick. 5/8" tall small grid of 1/2" on center wall & 9/8" tall large grid of 1" on center wall. The false ad about these gel cushions is the"air circulation". If set on a solid seat pan there is no air circulation unless you do a push up to get your butt up in the air. Does your Wondergel have 2 different size grids and which side do you sit on?
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby flagman1776 » 25 Jul 2018, 16:49

No, it's all one size grids & you are right about air circulation. Unless you place it on a vented base, there can't possibly be air circulation. Maybe if someone built a base with air channels & a blower??? WHEE!!
I've never used the supplied cover, preferring to use small terry towels (dedicated hand sized towels) loose. They're reasonably soft & easily washed. I like the give & conforming of this cushion as superior to the various foam I've tried & continue to use.

This isn't completely satisfactory or I'd not be looking at other options.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 17:19

No, it's all one size grids & you are right about air circulation. Unless you place it on a vented base, there can't possibly be air circulation. Maybe if someone built a base with air channels & a blower??? WHEE!!


The alternating air cells on the cushion I ordered have tiny holes that blow air when inflated. Thats how they deflate.
This applies to 3 mattresses and to the 240v powered cushion, and to the newer mobile cushion I ordered.

Key features

Nylon TPU coated cells
Independently removable cells
Micro-perforated cells
Multi-stretch PU cover
Water resistant, vapour permeable cover
Antimicrobial, machine washable cover
Robust pump connection
Transport mode

1 vid covers beds and cusions.
https://www.spearheadhealthcare.com/Cat ... 502-ALT215
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby flagman1776 » 25 Jul 2018, 18:36

Thanks Burgerman for that. I think I'd like to know if the "bed" system is adaptable to a lay-flat power lift chair. It seems very well thought out.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby MichaelB » 25 Jul 2018, 18:50

Burgerman wrote:Cancelled the order since they are making bullshit escuses about missing todays delivery. And wasted another 2 days of my life. So they are scammers. And a bunch of review sites agrees. So cancelled. Instead I ordered from

https://www.spearheadhealthcare.com/Cat ... 502-ALT215

They included the USB hand controller for free, and they changed the pump/battery for a more expensive quieter slightly higher pressure one for high risk or ongoing sore issues. For free. And price matched the lower price. Total cost 410.

And garanteed delivery for 1pm tomorrow. So another 24 hours wasted on my bed.


The link takes me to a cushion cover, did you get a cushion or the cover?
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 19:09

The link, on a real PC computer, in IE, Chrome, Firefox, takes you to a page with a complete cushion, inc cover, inset alternating air tubes, a lithium powered pump, and a controller. With a video, and some information. With foam polyurethane base that has closed cell bottom, sides, and back, with a firmer front edge where your legs go. Complete. And you can just buy a new cushion without pump. If you want. If you are using a mac, or an i-something, or phone to view the internet as I suspect, then god knows what you will see as they dont work properly...

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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 19:33

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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 25 Jul 2018, 19:39

Already have a plan to fit the larger box with pump/battery inside the front/lower part of the seat cushion foam, so its hidden and sound is reduced. Hot knife time... Cut a tight fitting rectangle out of the bottom face. So the whole thing is self contained, and possibly run it from the chairs big battery too. Just leave a power cable and the USB thingy hanging out under the seat. And a bit of velcro to mount the controller under the seat pan between my knees.

Then no need to hang anything behind. Although I already have a bag with lots of junk in.

And this cushion is 17.5 wide. And 19 deep. I usually use 18.5 wide, and 20 deep.
So will add self adhesive black polyurethane closed cell foam to each side (half inch or 12mm thick). Because I have some! And two layers to add 1 inch to the front. Then it will be a perfect fit into my prefered quality black Jay2 covers of which I already have 4 the correct size...

This will make it much quieter with a pump under the 4 inches of foam. And just as controllable with the USB thingy. And the correct size, and black! :clap
Then I will order another one if it works as expected.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby foghornleghorn » 25 Jul 2018, 21:18

What sort of seat base are you using, board or sling? I can't sit for long with a solid board under the cushion and had to special order a sling seat for my current wheelchair. With the sling seat any pressure is constantly shifting even with a fairly hard standard gel cushion.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby sacharlie » 25 Jul 2018, 22:38

foghornleghorn wrote:What sort of seat base are you using, board or sling? I can't sit for long with a solid board under the cushion and had to special order a sling seat for my current wheelchair. With the sling seat any pressure is constantly shifting even with a fairly hard standard gel cushion.


How taut is your sling seat? As loose as on a folding manual chair or tight as on a manual rigid chair.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby MichaelB » 26 Jul 2018, 10:34

Burgerman wrote:The link, on a real PC computer, in IE, Chrome, Firefox, takes you to a page with a complete cushion, inc cover, inset alternating air tubes, a lithium powered pump, and a controller. With a video, and some information. With foam polyurethane base that has closed cell bottom, sides, and back, with a firmer front edge where your legs go. Complete. And you can just buy a new cushion without pump. If you want. If you are using a mac, or an i-something, or phone to view the internet as I suspect, then god knows what you will see as they dont work properly...

Image
I'm using a Mac which runs on a UNIX based OS and has the ability to run the virus prone, bloated OS windows which sadly I have to use at times mainly when no mac program exists. It should make no difference to a hard link, that is just an address on the web. And unlike the limited PC I just fired the mac into a Windows 10 OS, used the browser and still got exactly the same page. I'll try and find the correct page with the options.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 10:46

This link, copied from your quote above, https://www.spearheadhealthcare.com/Cat ... 502-ALT215

Code: Select all
https://www.spearheadhealthcare.com/Catalogue/Pressure-Care/Alternating-Air-Cushion-Systems/Alerta-Mobile-Battery-Powered-Overlay-Alternating-Cushion-System-high-risk-ALT-21502-ALT215


Goes to this page on any normal properly functioning system... So I have no idea what yours is doing! Does anyone else get sent to the wrong page?

As for windows, once correctly configured, you have no more worries about viruses or security than any other system. I have setups running 24/7 year on year, used intensively, and have never had a virus or any other problem in at least a decade. My real time anti virus program isnt even turned on, and only checks once a week as I sleep. Unless you are stupid enough to actively choose to run some infected file. And unlike macs it will actually run stuff. And tons of software is available, esp for equipment. I dont have to resort to running a mac emulator to use all my chargers, and hobby stuff, tools, quadcopter, servo programmers, chair programmers, etc. And many other things because it is all written for windows. Would you like a list. Macs are OK for writing letters, surfing the web, or phones but cant do much else. But their browsers often break stuff and layouts look wrong. I used to check all my sites in multiple browsers. But thats your choice. And for what its worth they are also unsafe. And linux /unix can also have viruses... You are believing in the myth. This server is always getting attacked too, and was hacked before. Guess what it runs on?

It should make no difference to a hard link, that is just an address on the web.

True. So why are you seeing something different to the rest of us? Beats me. Something redirecting you or DNS cached and not refreshing, or god knows what.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 11:15

To refresh the DNS and every other cache click refresh while holding down the shift or the control key dep on browser. Although that may be different in whatever you use... That forces it to fetch a fresh page and replaces cached links, dns server data, and forces the database to re-search and give your computer fresh data. So nothing gets stuck in cached servers on the web on the way to you. Or maybe this bug? https://appletoolbox.com/2012/09/ios-6- ... oblem-fix/

You see the scottish girl kyra johnson on the chat bottom right in that screenshot, she is very helpful. She reduced the 555 price to 410, and added the USB controller for free. I like her. Esp If it turns up before 1pm as promised.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 12:52

I am in error. Just been informed that she said if I ordered before 1 it would arrive next day... Not delivered before 1...

So I have to wait all day. ANOTHER day wasted. banghead
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby hank » 26 Jul 2018, 13:13

Get where you coming from John.
Nothing is ever straight forward
All the best and good luck with your new Cushion when arrives :thumbup:
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 13:27

This is my logic, reasoning, physics...
As I see it it can really be just 2 things.

1. Transfering with a board, so shear forces. Most of the muscle that used to be my backside has gone due to sitting as a paraplegic for 22 years. So skin, and bony Ischeal Tuberosity bones not sliding well... So will manage with a towel jammed between bed and chair and no board.

2. Pressure on the same bone in the same place. This started happening now and again years ago. Now its 6 weeks to heal, 2 days up to do it all over... So having alternate air sacs inflate and deflate means you give it bloodflow every 6 mins, for 6 mins. Instead of sitting on it all day. That logically HAS to allow it to oxygenate. There are lots of reports of alternate filling air cushions healing sores.

So if this doesent sort it, I am at a loss.

If it works, and it should, I am going to build a couple of super high quality, high tech long lasting silent cushions using many mterials. Custom built for myself. That runs from the chair. Will make a mould for the base so I can use the correct cushion size, shape, and leave a space for the air cells. Which I am thinking about. They are not hard to make in very high quality from various tube types that will last. For eg fibre reinforced siicone tube. And pumps can be silent diaphram and so brushless as we only need 1 to 3 psi. And air solenoid valves for release. A few mosfets, a couple of 555 chips, and a few pots. and good to go... I can make it super reliable if not actually cheap, not expensive. The base can be silicone, or a Polyurethane poured silicone mix in different areas to fill the mould. And theres lots of quality covers made from breathable spacer fabric available online.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby hank » 26 Jul 2018, 14:18

I'm sure in what you are out to achive will work :thumbup:
When will anybody in our world ever listen to what needs we ask and want
for our Disabilities.
Proper winds me up. :roll:
Every thing we all do new from manufacturers has to be modified.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 15:20

OK. Arrived.

The good. Cells, pipes, layout all quite good. Pump, newer style, is almost silent, sounds like an aquarium air pump. Theres actually 2 in there. So thats good. Controls and layout also better. No remote. Run time now up to 48 hours, and at least a 24 hour day set to max pressure, 10 mins cycle at max 130kg user weight. (every 5 you get a new set of cells inflated so 10 is a complete cycle.) and it charges twice as fast. Why? Because they reduced battery capacity by half. Just 3x 18650 cells. Pump comes with case.

The bad. Cover still dark blue... Dont want that! And the cushion foam is a flimsy bit of memory foam, sit on it and it will just go flat as a pancake. That will be going into the bin. It offeres no support at the thighs, and is a joke or an afterthought. But then I already guessed this, and planned to replace it and use a better DIY cushion base, or modified Jay2 base anyway. So who cares!

Looks like about 50 quids worth of parts. But if it lets me get up its worth 10x its 400 pound easily.

Its about to go through an improvement program -- as usual.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby sacharlie » 26 Jul 2018, 15:45

Burgerman wrote:OK. Arrived.



Its about to go through an improvement program -- as usual.

PICs....VIDEO! Show%tell! Show&tell! Show&tell! :clap :clap :clap
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 16:25

Cant, on bed.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby MichaelB » 26 Jul 2018, 16:57

What cushion were you using before this new one? I've had numerous Roho's, all pressure mapping very well. Made a pressure gauge which I took to pressure mapping and checked the pressure using numbers not a stupid finger test and have my carers set correctly once a week. I still get sores every few months on my IT's. Back in bed now with another.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby stevelawiw » 26 Jul 2018, 17:02

If transfers on/off bed are an issue how about an overhead hoist? I've got four in my house. I can't transfer anymore since I tore a muscle off in my shoulder.
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 17:08

Basically I am ordering 2 slabs of foam. Heavy duty stuff that doesent give much. Its called reconstituted, and lots if bits of foam stuck together.

Base, 1 inch of foam. no cutouts, just a solid rectangle 19 wide and 20 deep.

Next goes the same type of foam, but 2 inches thick. And the same size. But this one has a rectangular hole cut for the 6 bars to fit, about 16 inches square. So they can sit in the hole eventually. And sit on the bottom 1 inch layer.

In the very top, a layer of soft blue foam, just 12mm (1/2 inch). It will wrap over the front, and into the hole. Except where the Coxccxxzxxcx is, and the ischealaelel tuberosities, where it will be missing in 4 inch circles under the inflating tubes. So 3 layers. Only soft on the top 1/2 inch. With a cut out for the tubes.

Then your leg weight will be taken by the foam. And only your backside and body by the tubes, and transfering will be easy. Will do pics. And order foam pre cut...

Sort of like this, with a hole in the top. And another 1 inch of that hard reconstituted foam on the bottom under this.. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/183333631450?ul_noapp=true
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Re: Active alternating air cushions???

Postby Burgerman » 26 Jul 2018, 17:16

What cushion were you using before this new one? I've had numerous Roho's, all pressure mapping very well. Made a pressure gauge which I took to pressure mapping and checked the pressure using numbers not a stupid finger test and have my carers set correctly once a week. I still get sores every few months on my IT's. Back in bed now with another.


Roho quad 4 chamber, hated it too unstable. Jay2 gels, many for years, like them. And a few trial ones like the vicair which was rubbish, and supracore etc.

Air alternating is the answer. The fact that you have another and NEED to pressure map proves that theres still too much. Sitting all day no matter what static cusion will cause sores sooner or later. If they positions alternate, it gives all of your backside a chance to see some blood circulation and oxygenate the cells.

Hoists? I have used them in hospitals, and patient lifts electric, at home, too slow, makes your house look like a hospital, and I dont feel safe!
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