WheelchairDriver • View topic - Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Power wheelchair board for REAL info!

POWERCHAIR MENU! www.wheelchairdriver.com/powerchair-stuff.htm

Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Rye » 10 Feb 2018, 21:58

Has anyone tried the Shinko 421 Knobby Tire? It says made from nylon. https://www.amazon.com/Shinko-Mini-Bike ... QH20WZ4PK1
Permobil C350/C300, Quickie P-222
User avatar
Rye
 
Posts: 373
Joined: 04 Sep 2013, 16:30
Location: US

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 10 Feb 2018, 23:21

Woven nylon casing, also used rayon, and sometimes steel banding. Rubber compound is the bit you drive on. OK for off road, dirt, or grass.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Rye » 11 Feb 2018, 16:06

Thanks. I've been seeing a lot of scooter tires around but they're all 3.50. Any trouble with them rubbing the motors on chairs? There's not much of a gap between the stock tires and the motors.
Permobil C350/C300, Quickie P-222
User avatar
Rye
 
Posts: 373
Joined: 04 Sep 2013, 16:30
Location: US

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 11 Feb 2018, 16:08

Depends on chair.

If you must you can use spacers. Or wider rims. Or go a fair bit wider such as 100/80, 110/80, or like below 120/70 -8 without big diameter. Like here:

download/file.php?id=7719&mode=view
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby tutatu » 11 Feb 2018, 21:41

User avatar
tutatu
 
Posts: 139
Joined: 16 Feb 2012, 13:56
Location: Belgrade, Serbia

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 13 Feb 2018, 03:37

i was considering that tire at one time - i ended up with the same rear tire as BM has - in a 350-8 size - and just changed out the fronts to 300-4

liking the look now -

i inflated them to 19 PSI to start with - seems like it would be more than enough - i may lower it to 15 once i test it

on my chair - on the stock rim - the 350-8 tire fit just right - - no room to spare near the motor - - with no spacers -
i would love to try those rims BM is using a bit wider but not there yet - using stock rims made it easy swap - no work involved -

i believe the size i would need to keep it stock size is 2.5 inch wide ? if i ever went tubeless - is that correct BM ?
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 13 Feb 2018, 03:57

Not sure what yours are now. But the best rim for 3.50 tyre is 2.5J rim to 2.75 width.

To go to the next size up that I have which is 120/70 or to 110/80 - 8 tyres needs a 3.5 rim. Theres loads of 2.5 and 3.5 rims though.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby ex-Gooserider » 13 Feb 2018, 04:22

They are tube-type, so can't be used tubeless safely... They may give a bit extra roughness on the ride as you go from one set of knobs to the next, especially on hard surfaces... OTOH, probably a lot better than the stock in terms of off-road capability.

ex-Gooserider
T-5, ASIA-B
Jazzy 1100
Jazzy Select 6
Quickie Q-7
Invacare Mariner
Want to make / get a better chair, ideally one that stands.
User avatar
ex-Gooserider
 
Posts: 4631
Joined: 15 Feb 2011, 06:17
Location: Billerica, MA. USA

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 13 Feb 2018, 04:30

2.5J ? rim size width 2.5

the stock rim says on the side 2.5 -

i dont want my chair any wider than it is already - if i ever even tried that - for me so far its working great this way and i have a decent rim -

this was and is the easiest way for me - tire mounted at bike shop - all i needed to do is mount to chair stock rim - nothing to do - had to just raise the fender
how ever the tech did it - not sure but it worked out just right
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 13 Feb 2018, 21:04

just added the front tire - Kenda brand 300-4 and they fit !!! - - feels so much better - i took a quick test run in the hallway of my building - hopefully will test it outdoors in the weekend -
Attachments
IMG_20180213_113412.jpg
IMG_20180213_112605.jpg
IMG_20180212_181741.jpg
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby snaker » 14 Feb 2018, 01:55

I am using these Kenda casters too. They make riding light and easy. The downside is that the caster shake is easier to happen :cussing Therefore the chair needs some fixes and the casters need a low pressure (mine is about 15psi).
User avatar
snaker
 
Posts: 573
Joined: 23 May 2015, 10:45
Location: Vietnam

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby shirley_hkg » 14 Feb 2018, 02:59

snaker wrote:They make riding light and easy. The downside is that the caster shake is easier to happen :cussing





I'll expect wobbly casters at speed on him also . :dance :dirtbike
shirley_hkg
 
Posts: 1787
Joined: 31 Dec 2010, 13:42

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 14 Feb 2018, 03:09

Really?

http://www.wheelchairdriver.com/BM3-con ... /15mph.mp4

This is mph not kph... So 24 kph
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 03:26

shirley_hkg wrote:
snaker wrote:They make riding light and easy. The downside is that the caster shake is easier to happen :cussing





I'll expect wobbly casters at speed on him also . :dance :dirtbike



Really ?? thats going to suck - i havnt tested it outdoors yet - i put 19 PSI for now - if i have to - i can go lower to 15PSI easy -

i was doing ok with the previous tries - - the forks are the same - rim also - i just went from the 9 inch 280 size to this one 300-4 - it does look huge compared to older tire now -
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 03:29

chair is very fast now - motor comp. at 40 gave it a bit more power and i can easily lift up the front end taking off from a flat surface - i have to be extra careful on hills and curb cuts


if its true would be depressing now - looks so much better and feels so much better
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby snaker » 14 Feb 2018, 03:30

Mine do not shake on the road surface like in the video. The shake only happens when meeting all of these conditions:
- Horizontal surfaces (I mean one side is higher than the other)
- Some sand or tiny gravel on road
- Speed >= 12kph
User avatar
snaker
 
Posts: 573
Joined: 23 May 2015, 10:45
Location: Vietnam

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 03:32

snaker wrote:Mine do not shake on the road surface like in the video. The shake only happens when meeting all of these conditions:
- Horizontal surfaces (I mean one side is higher than the other)
- Some sand or tiny gravel on road
- Speed >= 12kph



yes i can see that happening when the road is not even on both sides - or when i lift up the front end and comes back down - can be tricky before it sticks

speed can make a difference - going faster lightens the front a bit

on plus side - tire is sticky - good rubber and rounded which makes it smoother turning i noticed this already the moment i sat in the chair and move it -

the squared edged kenda i have before were good also but were sticky when turning slow many times indoors
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby shirley_hkg » 14 Feb 2018, 03:40

Burgerman wrote:Really?

This is mph not kph... So 24 kph


The geometry is not right , on his fork .
shirley_hkg
 
Posts: 1787
Joined: 31 Dec 2010, 13:42

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 04:00

whats wrong with the fork ?

theres nothing that can be adjusted - the fork postion is the only way it would fit

all i did was replace the 280 tire before with this one -
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 14 Feb 2018, 06:09

Mine do not shake on the road surface like in the video. The shake only happens when meeting all of these conditions:
- Horizontal surfaces (I mean one side is higher than the other)
- Some sand or tiny gravel on road
- Speed >= 12kph


Thats caused by CG too high. Happens on my bm chairs too if seating mount is raised by 1 inch. Or if rear tyre pressures not equal. Because in both cases it lifts weight off one caster. And people think they can just add a heavy set to it... :shock:
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Burgerman » 14 Feb 2018, 06:12

the squared edged kenda i have before were good also but were sticky when turning slow many times indoors


Motor compensation too low...

And or/ too nose heavy. And the torque setting too low. (that actually adds motor compensation at slow speeds to stop the exact thing described) But if the base setting is too low then it does nothing. I reduced mine on the same linix 4 pole from the stock 45mOhm to 40 for what its worth.
User avatar
Burgerman
Site Admin
 
Posts: 39628
Joined: 27 May 2008, 21:24
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 17:00

Burgerman wrote:
the squared edged kenda i have before were good also but were sticky when turning slow many times indoors


Motor compensation too low...

And or/ too nose heavy. And the torque setting too low. (that actually adds motor compensation at slow speeds to stop the exact thing described) But if the base setting is too low then it does nothing. I reduced mine on the same linix 4 pole from the stock 45mOhm to 40 for what its worth.



My chair was stock at 30mOhm and i raised it to 40 now - i havnt used the chair outdoors yet - i may take a quick spin today to see how it feels with the tires -

about these forks tires now -

the chair before i added these new 300-4 Kenda tire - was working fine - i had the same forks - same position - only difference was i had a smaller tire overall on it - 280-250-4 size which is a stock size tire for this fork - chair etc, - so that worked fine - now all i did is change the tire to a 300-4 - which everyone talks about here and you BM always use and recommend - etc, so i tried it and it fits - clears my motors and foot rests - thats the only thing i did -

if it works great - if it dosnt - i can lower the PSI maybe - give it some time to break in and wear out a bit - i have 19 PSI - will test it today outdoors and see -

i actually feel much better even sitting in the chair - seems to make me level and feels great in my hallways flat smooth surface - feels much more powerful taking off - will easily lift the front end - which may not be a good thing - i will see - i made no other changes to the chair - 40 motor comp. - and front tires -

worst case - i have to go back to my old tire size - - which i dont want to do now - seeing how great the chair looks this way - and feels so far
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 14 Feb 2018, 22:08

I rode it for about 7 miles - and yes the tires trip up ever now and then - depends on surface but its happen a few times too many for my liking - i say its simliar to when i first installed the previous tires which i lowered the PSI and it basically solved it - not 100% but good enough not to worry -

I made the effort to put these tires on - i used them so cant return them - they look great and feel great - my only option is to lower the PSI enough where it wont happen or very rarely - i felt it was too high also either way - i will try 15PSI for the next time and see if that helps - using it over some time may work with lower PSI also

if not - then back to the ones i had and move on - i want to at least use them for a summer if i can now they are installed already - unless its that bad that i cant use them - so thats the verdict -
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Rye » 19 Feb 2018, 01:02

what kind of caster tires are y'all running? all i'm seeing on google are plain jane grey.
Permobil C350/C300, Quickie P-222
User avatar
Rye
 
Posts: 373
Joined: 04 Sep 2013, 16:30
Location: US

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby expresso » 19 Feb 2018, 01:43

Rye wrote:what kind of caster tires are y'all running? all i'm seeing on google are plain jane grey.


http://www.partsforscooters.com/154-104_Kenda_Tire

i just installed these -

working on lowering the PSI to 12 and test again - at 14.5 PSI - they were better but still trip up now and then - - i think 12 should do it

this is on the 646se with fixed forks -

these didnt fit on my P222se - they hit my footrests - but these work fine

www.partsforscooters.com/search-results ... 80%2F250-4
Quickie P222se - - 60ah ADD on pack -
Quickie S646se - - 105ah LifePo4 Pack + 30ah ADD ON - 135ah total
Quickie P220 - Indoor Chair
expresso
 
Posts: 6070
Joined: 10 May 2010, 03:17
Location: NYC - NY

Re: Shinko 421 Knobby Tire

Postby Rye » 22 Feb 2018, 04:37

I have a permobil and did finally find some affordable caster tires in black or grey.

http://enableyourlife.com/210-65-multi- ... uctadded=1
Permobil C350/C300, Quickie P-222
User avatar
Rye
 
Posts: 373
Joined: 04 Sep 2013, 16:30
Location: US


Return to Everything Powerchair

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: hobie1dog and 66 guests

 

  eXTReMe Tracker